Is Desert Storm overpowered?

I saw that the strategy was banned for The Punishment tournament, so I wonder what's the general feel about it.

Desert Storm generally doesn't need a nerf.
I dont know what Punisher tournament has to do with DS buff or nerf or this poll in general.


I repeat again and again few simple sentences that we decided to ban it for east matches (read Ukraine) in Punisher tournament since there are 128 players, not only including competitives, but lower ranks, non prems and scenario boys too. Just to equalize things a bit for them against Ukraine we decided to ban it over there.
Nothing else. It's so simple.

For no restriction tournaments, you have also a Duel tournament where basically only competitives participate.

Ds is only op with ukr in duel its normal or shit everywhere else no need to nerf, we can't nerf something only based on 1 map it's only makes noob strategy or op.
To nerf ds ukr you need to start balancing eu+.

The current generation of players really suck.

If you cant handle ds ukr with turk youre a bad player.

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 14:45

The current generation of players really suck.

If you cant handle ds ukr with turk youre a bad player.

We do


Personally I don't think there is a problem with the current way DS is, just needs to work out some kinks. In general my opinion is that there are no bad strats, just bad players. A lot of newer players to the scene like myself, tungston, dopey, etc all just lack the experience and need to actually play more often and learn more from our mistakes.

I agree that it is pretty overpowered playing it as ukraine. As for world games it ends up being pretty weak because anti air really does counter it. And DS also has no secondary powerful attack. You could say marines but 120 cost marines is pretty expensive as it is.

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 14:45

The current generation of players really suck.

If you cant handle ds ukr with turk youre a bad player.

Bro I'm sure you would get raped by grom's or nic's ds ukr ez, and stop lying bro my turk is pretty good and it's hard af to beat a good ds ukr like grom/nic one even bugs's ds ukr is hard af to beat.
Can you just stop coming on forum and says we suck? Maybe if old players didn't stop playing they could have taught us how to play rather than insulting us.

נכתב על ידי Froyer, 22.02.2020 at 16:01

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 14:45

The current generation of players really suck.

If you cant handle ds ukr with turk youre a bad player.

Bro I'm sure you would get raped by grom's or nic's ds ukr ez, and stop lying bro my turk is pretty good and it's hard af to beat a good ds ukr like grom/nic one even bugs's ds ukr is hard af to beat.
Can you just stop coming on forum and says we suck? Maybe if old players didn't stop playing they could have taught us how to play rather than insulting us.

Yea I agree with froyer. Laochra is a ok player at best so I am not sure why he says people are bad players and I think he underestimates DS ukraine.

Ooof...



Tengri give me ur gif-maker program... thnx

RIP Lao 1927-2020

I stomped groms ds ukr in duels countless times and that was before the last nerf. Took nics down too. Stronger ds incarnations than the 1 youre crying about now existed since 2016 back when i actually played. The very fact that someone like mecoy has hit 1700 elo is a testament to the level of the current generation.

I wrote you a turk guide on how to efficiently play imp. I cant do much more than that.

Desert Storm is just real OP with Ukraine, generally, the strategy is not that good. The Best Idea would be to just nerf ukraine really.

נכתב על ידי Alois, 22.02.2020 at 15:01

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 14:45

The current generation of players really suck.

If you cant handle ds ukr with turk youre a bad player.

We do


Personally I don't think there is a problem with the current way DS is, just needs to work out some kinks. In general opinion is that there are no bad strats, just bad players. A lot of newer players to the scene like myself, tungston, dopey, etc all just lack the experience and need to actually play more often and learn more from our mistakes.

did ya hear that, nerfing ukraine = solution

The only thing I would probably do is remove the Militia extra range, some fuckwit suggested that be added so it's easier to defend with the strategy but Desert storm is more of a shock-forced early game strategy where you sacrifice your defense for pure attack, so idk why some FUCKING MORON decided it was a good idea to give it a better chance at defending too. Can't remember who it was but damn that guy is STUPID

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 17:32

I stomped groms ds ukr in duels countless times and that was before the last nerf. Took nics down too. Stronger ds incarnations than the 1 youre crying about now existed since 2016 back when i actually played. The very fact that someone like mecoy has hit 1700 elo is a testament to the level of the current generation.

I wrote you a turk guide on how to efficiently play imp. I cant do much more than that.

First grom's ds ukr is stronger than nic's ds ukr
I played and won both it was easier to beat nic's one than grom's one (I'm not telling grom is better nic is better than him), and there is only 1 good and ez ds expansion with small changes like bulg or rs now they even take Cyprus, except if your name is bugs and always want to make new exp when almost all have been done before, that's what he did with ukr on casper's acc not only with ds ukr.
You said you stomped grom's and nic's ds ukr but I have won agaisnt 9 ds ukr in a row nic won and stopped my win streak agaisnt it, I wasnt playing agaisnt noobs, was mostly bugs with hacks on but he raped nic and duel scene.

All old duellers left I miss them too when you see that the top 5 players are nic, eag, grom, mecoy and I, and rest can't contest us when we are tryharding I agree competitive is not what it was before.

New players lack of experience old players stopped playing and didn't make enough good guide like your turkey guide.

It's a pretty good one I have to agree, I learned turkey from it and with old players help like opi.

The meta is becoming tb rush it's not overexpand and rush anymore so your playstyle might get raped with so many tbs, I made my own playstyle to counter all ukr strategies but all are different because you can't do the same t2 if he's gw or ds, if he's gw you need to grab all the reinf you can and steal ukr reinf (like Pol cities) if he's ds you need to kill his units before he get reinf in west and takes full west, it's ez to say harder to do because few small ds heli rush/lm like nic likes to do can rape you easily and since everyone is copying him you got a lot of mini rusher and tb spammer no more lategamers.

When I started to play turkey so in 2018, you weren't dueling only cwing with illy and raping seasons, I was in elites when I started cwing (maybe you will remember some meme when mk accused illy of farming elites) the expansion with turkey was slow, would be raped today if you expand like that, now turkey takes Paris t2 to win west fast because everyone stopped rushing (it's changing blame me I told tips to almost all new competitive players), Ukraine expansion changed a lot too now if you don't take bene t2 you are top slow and can't take it next turn cuz turkey got north Ita cities and Paris reinf +gen (to be faster than turkey in west I take benelux T1 with Mos ukr).
East became a battle of overexpand and the one who win west, win the game.

I can name you one of the new turkey expansion that you don't know how to do cuz we are only 2 to know (maybe nic idk if I told him), bugs and I made it to counter ds ukr ez, it's 1 trans expansion with Rome, Serbia, Albania, Romania, Bulgaria and greece as I said only 1 naval trans, I remember when you were trying to beat grom's ds ukr you did this expansion but without Greece, bugs and I managed to do it with Greece and I can have 2100 money t2 with 25 reinfs in turkey if I want to rush Kiev t4 or def Ankara, I can overexpand easily without caring to get rushed because of the 25 reinfs un turkey, with this expansion I can do many other things like latemoves with ats etc.

Ukraine players who overexpand would rape all old players who plays turkey like in early 2018, I can tell you that because early game is too much important for east game , mid game turkey won't be able to def agaisnt main attack units spam.

But I agree with you nobody can play turkey correctly not even mecoy, nic or grom, they would get raped by their ds ukr not mine because I didn't play it enough to master it and know every move I can do.
But it's not because we are very good turkey players, that we have the right to insult the rest of competitive players for being noobs, most of the lowranks I train finish to have a good turkey but they don't have the skill to beat players like nic and grom, imagine giving someone who's better than you an op strat it's impossible to beat.

Lao you need to stop being subjective if you want to help be objective bro we can't balance something around our skills zzzzzz.

The meta is the exact same as I left it froyer. The only change was the recent one to blitz. You've described nothing new to me. I've encountered and used all this gameplay.

Your 1 trans turk expand(if imperialist) sounds like bug abuse.

None of the current strats are overpowered. No nerfs needed. Just a buff for mos and a few changes to some other strats to rotate the meta.

It does not need nerfed, these people are just noobs or idiots or both

נכתב על ידי Tribune Aquila, 22.02.2020 at 19:30

It does not need nerfed, these people are just noobs or idiots or both

or sean or spicer or both

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 19:26

The meta is the exact same as I left it froyer. The only change was the recent one to blitz. You've described nothing new to me. I've encountered and used all this gameplay.

Your 1 trans turk expand(if imperialist) sounds like bug abuse.

None of the current strats are overpowered. No nerfs needed. Just a buff for mos and a few changes to some other strats to rotate the meta.

Thank you for putting it so eloquently.

I really like Desert Storm when I pick on the world map. As I'm sure many of you know I'm not the most competitive player, but being competitive does not mean that one must be an alpha male; by the same token, not being competitive does not mean that one cannot be an alpha male, hence I could very well be an alpha male unbeknownst to some of you who might want to question that, probably because of a personal vendetta. But my point is that I love to play Desert Storm on the World Map because it makes me feel like I'm re-enacting the Gulf War. I love to pick USA: Atlantic and then annihilate people with Desert Storm, then take over the world with the really American strategy. Of course it should be powerful, that's the whole point.

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 19:26

The meta is the exact same as I left it froyer. The only change was the recent one to blitz. You've described nothing new to me. I've encountered and used all this gameplay.

Your 1 trans turk expand(if imperialist) sounds like bug abuse.

None of the current strats are overpowered. No nerfs needed. Just a buff for mos and a few changes to some other strats to rotate the meta.

Meta is still the same but improved with better expansion and added tb spam to it.

Nah 1 trans turk expand imperialist isn't bug abuse bridging got legalized D.

Agreed no nerf needed, but some strategies need buff like Mos, ra, blitz (because its still shit), and what about new strategies it's boring to play with the same thing over and over.

Changing the meta is hard and buffing the strats is hard when people are scared to change it too fast.

נכתב על ידי Froyer, 22.02.2020 at 18:45

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 17:32

I stomped groms ds ukr in duels countless times and that was before the last nerf. Took nics down too. Stronger ds incarnations than the 1 youre crying about now existed since 2016 back when i actually played. The very fact that someone like mecoy has hit 1700 elo is a testament to the level of the current generation.

I wrote you a turk guide on how to efficiently play imp. I cant do much more than that.

First grom's ds ukr is stronger than nic's ds ukr
I played and won both it was easier to beat nic's one than grom's one (I'm not telling grom is better nic is better than him), and there is only 1 good and ez ds expansion with small changes like bulg or rs now they even take Cyprus, except if your name is bugs and always want to make new exp when almost all have been done before, that's what he did with ukr on casper's acc not only with ds ukr.
You said you stomped grom's and nic's ds ukr but I have won agaisnt 9 ds ukr in a row nic won and stopped my win streak agaisnt it, I wasnt playing agaisnt noobs, was mostly bugs with hacks on but he raped nic and duel scene.

All old duellers left I miss them too when you see that the top 5 players are nic, eag, grom, mecoy and I, and rest can't contest us when we are tryharding I agree competitive is not what it was before.

New players lack of experience old players stopped playing and didn't make enough good guide like your turkey guide.

It's a pretty good one I have to agree, I learned turkey from it and with old players help like opi.

The meta is becoming tb rush it's not overexpand and rush anymore so your playstyle might get raped with so many tbs, I made my own playstyle to counter all ukr strategies but all are different because you can't do the same t2 if he's gw or ds, if he's gw you need to grab all the reinf you can and steal ukr reinf (like Pol cities) if he's ds you need to kill his units before he get reinf in west and takes full west, it's ez to say harder to do because few small ds heli rush/lm like nic likes to do can rape you easily and since everyone is copying him you got a lot of mini rusher and tb spammer no more lategamers.

When I started to play turkey so in 2018, you weren't dueling only cwing with illy and raping seasons, I was in elites when I started cwing (maybe you will remember some meme when mk accused illy of farming elites) the expansion with turkey was slow, would be raped today if you expand like that, now turkey takes Paris t2 to win west fast because everyone stopped rushing (it's changing blame me I told tips to almost all new competitive players), Ukraine expansion changed a lot too now if you don't take bene t2 you are top slow and can't take it next turn cuz turkey got north Ita cities and Paris reinf +gen (to be faster than turkey in west I take benelux T1 with Mos ukr).
East became a battle of overexpand and the one who win west, win the game.

I can name you one of the new turkey expansion that you don't know how to do cuz we are only 2 to know (maybe nic idk if I told him), bugs and I made it to counter ds ukr ez, it's 1 trans expansion with Rome, Serbia, Albania, Romania, Bulgaria and greece as I said only 1 naval trans, I remember when you were trying to beat grom's ds ukr you did this expansion but without Greece, bugs and I managed to do it with Greece and I can have 2100 money t2 with 25 reinfs in turkey if I want to rush Kiev t4 or def Ankara, I can overexpand easily without caring to get rushed because of the 25 reinfs un turkey, with this expansion I can do many other things like latemoves with ats etc.

Ukraine players who overexpand would rape all old players who plays turkey like in early 2018, I can tell you that because early game is too much important for east game , mid game turkey won't be able to def agaisnt main attack units spam.

But I agree with you nobody can play turkey correctly not even mecoy, nic or grom, they would get raped by their ds ukr not mine because I didn't play it enough to master it and know every move I can do.
But it's not because we are very good turkey players, that we have the right to insult the rest of competitive players for being noobs, most of the lowranks I train finish to have a good turkey but they don't have the skill to beat players like nic and grom, imagine giving someone who's better than you an op strat it's impossible to beat.

Lao you need to stop being subjective if you want to help be objective bro we can't balance something around our skills zzzzzz.

Reading froyers post like:

נכתב על ידי Froyer, 23.02.2020 at 03:49

Nah 1 trans turk expand imperialist isn't bug abuse bridging got legalized D.

This is not an unknown expansion. Why take Serbia instead of Italian port cities with this one sea trans expansion.

נכתב על ידי Chess, 23.02.2020 at 05:07

נכתב על ידי Froyer, 23.02.2020 at 03:49

Nah 1 trans turk expand imperialist isn't bug abuse bridging got legalized D.

This is not an unknown expansion. Why take Serbia instead of Italian port cities with this one sea trans expansion.

Because u don't need Naples to take Paris t2 with imp turk

נכתב על ידי Froyer, 23.02.2020 at 05:09

נכתב על ידי Chess, 23.02.2020 at 05:07

נכתב על ידי Froyer, 23.02.2020 at 03:49

Nah 1 trans turk expand imperialist isn't bug abuse bridging got legalized D.

This is not an unknown expansion. Why take Serbia instead of Italian port cities with this one sea trans expansion.

Because u don't need Naples to take Paris t2 with imp turk

paris t2 without naples? impossible without AT or naples.

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 14:45

The current generation of players really suck.

If you cant handle ds ukr with turk youre a bad player.

There's better ways of phrasing that, Lao -.-
Also, it's not that easy to beat DS ukraine when you don't predict that you're opponent's gonna use it, compared to other strats.

If you know he or she going DS, it's much easier to beat him or her.

I even think ds needs a buff. indeed, with ukr is op, but it still needs a buff for other maps.

נכתב על ידי Lelouch., 24.02.2020 at 11:05

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 14:45

The current generation of players really suck.

If you cant handle ds ukr with turk youre a bad player.

There's better ways of phrasing that, Lao -.-
Also, it's not that easy to beat DS ukraine when you don't predict that you're opponent's gonna use it, compared to other strats.

If you know he or she going DS, it's much easier to beat him or her.

You're opinion is irrelevant because you use exploits

נכתב על ידי Augustus Caesar, 24.02.2020 at 11:27

נכתב על ידי Lelouch., 24.02.2020 at 11:05

נכתב על ידי Permamuted, 22.02.2020 at 14:45

The current generation of players really suck.

If you cant handle ds ukr with turk youre a bad player.

There's better ways of phrasing that, Lao -.-
Also, it's not that easy to beat DS ukraine when you don't predict that you're opponent's gonna use it, compared to other strats.

If you know he or she going DS, it's much easier to beat him or her.

You're opinion is irrelevant because you use exploits

I love you too

I phrased it that way because this is annoying. People complaining about a strat and trying to get further nerfs on it due to 1 limited setting. And theyre not even right about that setting!

Ds was op when we had +1 militia def. It was very debateable whether we needed the heli def nerf. I didn't argue too much against it because i saw it as negligible. But that's it. Done. The strat is fine.

I think a ds v turk battle favours turk. Im guessing 60:40 to turk. I personally have a far higher winrate than that vs ds and thats vs people like grom, nic, witch, xcol etc. You cannot beat a turkey with a passive overexpand ds. You have to at least partially rush their expansion in the balks. Then take some risks to contain turks expansion. If you dont do this and turk is competent you are dead.

Ds HAS to secure west money to contest turkey. Similarly Turkey HAS to secure full italy asap to contest ds. I dont like that paris rush. It leaves you vulnerable to rushes yourself. And it yields roughly the same income as full ita. I will concede though that it really fucks any slowrolling ukraine which seeks to expand west.

Here's what you need to do as turk. If youre expecting ds this will really mess with them.

1. You can pd rush. Personally i think imp slowroll is better.

2. As imp, get rome t1 and full italy t2. Play safe in balkans. min greece and safe stack 1 of serb/bulg/romania.

3. Use italy to push hard on bene/paris. If ds loses west its fucked. Even if it unites full scandi/russia its not enough to contest turk. It needs far more income to be dangerous. Even if you engage in a trade off with ds on those lands its enough. Youll reduce their income. Its very hard for ds to defend and youll have the funds from italy to push on those lands with tanks.

4. Its very easy to spot if a slowrolling ds is going to try a rush. Youll usually need very little to defend and can focus most units on agression/pressure. Leave 2 or so spawn in ankara for surprise AAs if needed.