Strategy boosts and nerfs!

As to now, we all know there are some weak and strong strategies. This suggestion could change that by making each and every strategy playable because we have too many unused strategies! I will make this short and sweet.

Boosts

Lucky Bastard
Probably the least used strategy. Players have been contemplating a boost for this strategy for months, if not a year. It desperately needs a boost and here's how. Start off by removing the "NONE" strategy and implying none's stats to lucky bastard. This meaning lucky bastard will lose its +10cost to all units making it like none exept with +7 ARB. (Because atm the +5 only makes a slight difference in battles 7 would make it more applicable and it's lucky number seven!! so why not?)

Desert Storm
Desert storm is weak because the sky menace bomber is so much more superior to the helicopter and desert storm's only good ground unit is infantries but in their case pd's and imp's infantry are superior due to cost.

Here's what I suggest:
-Make helicopters 130 cost instead of 150
-Make marines 5 attack instead of 6 but with a cost of 90 instead of 120.
-Make helicopters have a marine capacity of 4

Tank General
At the moment, Great combinator's tanks are better offensively than tank general's because they are both 9 attack except gc has an extra HP. Why is this? TG is the GENERAL OF TANKS, they should be better. I suggest making them 10 attack instead of 9 that is all that has to be done to balance it with its terrible defence.

Nerfs

Sky Menace
The strongest pound for pound strategy hands down. Couldn't suggest it any better than Pinheiro did in his thread found here >> http://afterwind.com/forum/topic.php?topic_id=3996

Here's what it suggested in short terms:

Bomber
8atk/6def ($130)
9atk/5def ($150)

Stealth
9atk/5def ($250)
9atk/4def ($230)

Sentry Plane
1atk/4def ($400) (60 view)
1atk/4def ($390) (70 view)

Air Transport
2atk/4def ($400) (3 capacity)
2atk/4def ($400) (4 capacity)

Imperialist
A strategy that has risen from ashes into becoming one of the most fearsome in the game. Not terribly overpowered but it needs a slight tweaking.

-Keep all units at -30 cost like usual except for the militia. Make them 10 cost instead of 0. Players can easily build free militia in all their unused cities each reinforcement week without cost. This is extremely overpowered especially when arriving at their territory seeing 50+ militia in all cities. Making them 10 cost would reduce this "spamming effect" but at the same time keep them very cheap for what they can do.

That is all. I think these boosts and nerfs are needed. They aren't terribly harsh or overdone.

Please discuss. For the sake of lucky bastard, tank general and desert storm. forever alone

Totaly agree here

Im not a big fan of ARB,but i allways liked tank general and tanks in BF3,and desert storm is known as underpowered.
but as for SM,you're to mercifull with the nerf,how about this:
bombers:7 attack/6 defence (150$)
stealth: 9 attack/4 defence (200$)
sentry plane:no change
air transport:2 attack/4 defence (500$)

Man, you've gone about that all the wrong way. You've got to think about what makes TG, LB and DS weak.

LB is weak because ARB is not clearly explained and cannot be relied upon. People would rather take a static buff to attack/defence than something that COULD work out if it went their way... the +10 cost is just a kick in the teeth.

TG is weak because Tanks cannot defend themselves. There's no shortage of attack and buffing the tanks attack even more would make them even more of a glass cannon. GC shits all over it because the tanks are stronger and a compotent player would mix tanks with infantry so there is no inherent weakness. TG is not about combining troops, it's about tanks. What do tanks lack? Defence. They could also use more range to differentiate them between GC tanks. GC Tank + Inf stack should still beat the equivelent TG tank stack because it requires more on the part of the individual to mix units in a stack. But TG should have a way to defend itself.

DS is weak because there are better strats (SM) which is pretty much the same just with longer range. I don't believe DS is as weak as you've made it out to be however it certainly needs a buff to EITHER infantry or marines so it has a ground unit bonus and isn't just SM but with a different name.

And gw?
good militia (4dmg, 5def) for only 30 coints? and mariens for only 80?

by comparing with mos:
gw:
militia 4dmg 5def 4range and 30cost
mariens 7dmg 3def 6range cost 80

mos:
infantry 4dmg 6def 6range 70cost
mariens 8dmg 3def 7range 130cost

the gw player can buy 133% more militia and is only 20% weaker & 50% fewer range
or he can buy 62,5% more mariens for decreasing 14% attack and 16% range

Desert Storm
-1 to Marines attack removed
View range is now +2 for both Marines and Helicopters
Helicopters cost is now -70 (used to be -50)

Lucky Bastard
ARB is now +10 - let's see how this goes
View range is now +4

Tank General
Tank defence +1, range +1

Sky Menace
Followed Pinheiro's suggestions, except left Bomber attack +2 and cost -30. Baby steps

Imperialist
+10 Militia cost (so they're not free anymore)

נכתב על ידי Lemonade, 17.06.2012 at 17:10

And gw?
good militia (4dmg, 5def) for only 30 coints? and mariens for only 80?

by comparing with mos:
gw:
militia 4dmg 5def 4range and 30cost
mariens 7dmg 3def 6range cost 80

mos:
infantry 4dmg 6def 6range 70cost
mariens 8dmg 3def 7range 130cost

the gw player can buy 133% more militia and is only 20% weaker & 50% fewer range
or he can buy 62,5% more mariens for decreasing 14% attack and 16% range

I don't bother enough to give you stats you might as well check yourself if you want to prove me wrong, so I'll just point out what you should look at:

GW's whole point is effective (and covert) use of low-cost and thus weaker units. Thus it makes sense to ruin regular troops - GW Tanks and Infantry are useless, and transports are a pain where it hurts quite a bit (your purse, that is) - and to boost the ones you'll actually use, i.e. Militia and Marines (the ONLY boost GW has, btw.).
What leaves you with a standard unit that's not useless, but significantly weaker than what other people have, and affordable Marines (And bombers, obviously, but bombers still are expensive).
An ambush is supposed to be powerful, and even though Marines are great, they will have some trouble with a strong defense and/or a well executed counter attack.

I deduce from it not being discussed yet that other people think like me (or don't give a shit); GW is fine as it is.

P.S.: Good job here, Tops. And wow, you really do take that serious, don't you? I think you might have killed the fun for poor old zizou.

WARNING MAY CONTAIN MATHS. I HAVE BOLDED THE IMPORTANT BITS, IF YOU DON'T LIKE MATHS THEN JUST TAKE MY WORD FOR IT.

Sky Menace turns you into a Sky Menace. Tank General makes you a Tank General. Great Combinator makes you use Combination.

Lucky Bastard is misnamed because it requires you to be a lucky bastard to make it work, it doesn't turn you into one. This is because ARB doesn't give you luck, it requires it.

I didn't post the maths for it in my last post but here it is:

נכתב על ידי Amok, 01.06.2011 at 12:23

The chance that you will get 1 ARB is currently fixed at 25%. Then you have a 66% chance for each consecutive +1.
Example:
25% ? 1
66% ? +1
66% ? +1
66% ? +1
= 4 ARB in total.

נכתב על ידי Aristosseur, 01.06.2011 at 12:43

So, total is:
+1 25%
+2 25%*66%=16,5%
+3 16,5%*66%=10,89%
+4 10,89%*66%=~7,19%

right?

This next chart represents the new +10 ARB LB strat. The first column is the 'number' of ARB attacks. The second column represents the way that ARB scales with itself. The third column shows the chance of reaching that amount of bonus.


+1 25%
+2 25%*66%=16,5%
+3 16,5%*66%=10,89%
+4 10,89%*66%=~7,19%
+5 7,19%*66%=~4,74
+6 4,74%*66%=~3,13
+7 3,13%*66%=~2,06
+8 2,06*66%=~1,36
+9 1,36*66%=~0,89
+10 0,89*66%=~0,58


Basically it works like this: You attack a unit, you have a 25% chance to get an extra attack from the ARB stat. But oh my you're LB and you've got 10 ARB. However, you don't get 10x 25% chances... that would essentially make LB Units gain ~2.5 attack from averaged out ARB.

Instead what you get is the chart above. Whilst you get the initial 25%, each additional point of ARB is worth less than the previous one. So much so that the 10th point of ARB gives a 0.58% chance to get an extra attack point.

In less mathy terms, you only have a 25% chance for ARB to work. If you get 'lucky' and your first ARB works, you've then got another 66% chance for it to work, and remember that if an ARB doesn't work then it stops at that point, future amounts of ARB don't matter once you get a roll fail.

It doesn't matter if you have +10 or +100 if the very first ARB roll doesn't go your way. The irony of the buff is that past 5 ARB the chances of bonus attack get incredibly small and so pretty much defeat the point of the change.

To keep things constructive, is there a way to change the 25% chance for ARB just for the LB strat? If LB were 50% with +5 ARB or 75% with +2 ARB. The 'luck' would be more or less garunteed with a noticable impact. Or perhaps LB gets a higher% chance to turnblock? It would totally change team play if there was a specific LB player in charge of blocking.

נכתב על ידי Ivan, 18.06.2012 at 02:06

Desert Storm
-1 to Marines attack removed
View range is now +2 for both Marines and Helicopters
Helicopters cost is now -70 (used to be -50)

Lucky Bastard
ARB is now +10 - let's see how this goes
View range is now +4

Tank General
Tank defence +1, range +1

Sky Menace
Followed Pinheiro's suggestions, except left Bomber attack +2 and cost -30. Baby steps

Imperialist
+10 Militia cost (so they're not free anymore)

Your such a good admin :3

Thanks for listening to the community. Idk if we give shitty advice or not - I'm a noob, but listening to us is what makes you the best

נכתב על ידי Ivan, 18.06.2012 at 02:06

Desert Storm
-1 to Marines attack removed
View range is now +2 for both Marines and Helicopters
Helicopters cost is now -70 (used to be -50)

Lucky Bastard
ARB is now +10 - let's see how this goes
View range is now +4

Tank General
Tank defence +1, range +1

Sky Menace
Followed Pinheiro's suggestions, except left Bomber attack +2 and cost -30. Baby steps

Imperialist
+10 Militia cost (so they're not free anymore)

tank general and desert storm are still quite weak. Tanks 10 attack man . desert storm needs more variety that's all. either range to helis to include them in stacks or add capacity, or make marines cheaper. Atm it's kinda stuck in the middle compared to its competition. Meaning infantries are still better than its marines, so marines are still useless to buy with DS.

נכתב על ידי tophat, 18.06.2012 at 21:51

נכתב על ידי Ivan, 18.06.2012 at 02:06

Desert Storm
-1 to Marines attack removed
View range is now +2 for both Marines and Helicopters
Helicopters cost is now -70 (used to be -50)

Lucky Bastard
ARB is now +10 - let's see how this goes
View range is now +4

Tank General
Tank defence +1, range +1

Sky Menace
Followed Pinheiro's suggestions, except left Bomber attack +2 and cost -30. Baby steps

Imperialist
+10 Militia cost (so they're not free anymore)

tank general and desert storm are still quite weak. Tanks 10 attack man . desert storm needs more variety that's all. either range to helis to include them in stacks or add capacity, or make marines cheaper. Atm it's kinda stuck in the middle compared to its competition. Meaning infantries are still better than its marines, so marines are still useless to buy with DS.

Yeah, i still wouldn't bother buying the marines, i would use helis to expand and drop in one inf

helis also need a range boost because i'm playing ds spain and i can't even reach paris first turn from madrid (with my general)

this is what i would do

_____________________________

Marines 6 attack 100 cost ( i removed the attack buff because doing this you don't really want people soley using marines, they are supposed to be support for the helis.)
Bombers only -1 range (14)
helis +5 range instead of +3 (13)
Helis +3 Marine capcity
Air transport -2 capacity +150 cost (makes it harder to transport infantry, and far more efficient to transport marines in the helis.)
_____________________________

another thing that needs adding is specific upgrades for this strategy
two i can think of is
general: Helicopter attack (another reason why SM is superior to DS, general gives the +1 attack, which is massive for death stacks.)
Helicopter range I (if this came in you would only need to increase heli range to +4, not +5)

נכתב על ידי nonames, 18.06.2012 at 22:33

Helis +3 Marine capcity
Air transport -2 capacity +150 cost (makes it harder to transport infantry, and far more efficient to transport marines in the helis.)

I don't support this because it makes Helicopters able to cap cities if they have even one marine in them. Consider the following: you see a massive stack of planes coming your way. You send a sentry plane to check out what they are. A) You see only bombers in the stack: "Lol, this noob can't cap my cities, dgaf" B) You see mainly bombers and one apparently empty air transport. Unless the man is playing SM, he stil can't cap your cities, but the empty air transport is a giveway. C) Only helis. PANIC: Marines have less attack than helis, so the heli/marine combo can cap a city
_____________________________

Suggesting some more buffs:

Naval Commander
Submarine/Destroyer +5 Range (this eqals the range of a normal bomber)
Submarine +1 Capacity

Desert Storm
Helicopter +1 HP

Tank General
Tank +1 defence bonus against Bomber and Stealth

Lucky Bastard
Infantry +1 HP
Militia +1 HP

And a nerf:
Sky Menace
Infantry -1 Range (I think Inf are a bit too strong for SM now)